Post by Eliyahu C. on Jan 30, 2021 14:20:22 GMT -5
Ken/ ImAHebrew wrote here: www.lo-ammi.org/forum/main/lo-ammi-forum/64402-the-beasts-of-revelations-part-1#post64403
Hey Ken/ImAHebrew,
Really, well what does the scriptures tell us in the prophet Daniel, and what identifies this beast that John saw in Revelation 13 and could you be a little more specific about what this beast really is?
And Ken, isn't man already sinful without having to rise up at all?
Revelation 13:1 by John: And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
Daniel 7And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another....
After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.....
I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things. These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth....
Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces..
So John's FIRST beast king and kingdom is Daniel's FOURTH beast king and kingdom that rises up out of the sea, and your problem Ken, is that you use the wrong set of scriptures to properly interpret itself on the matter.
And I guess there is no one able to post on LO-AMMI to even tell you of your mistake.
The Beasts of Revelations
(Rev 13:1-18) (1) And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. (2) And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as [the feet] of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority. (3) And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. (4) And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who [is] like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? (5) And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty [and] two months. (6) And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against Elohim, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. (7) And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. (8) And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (9) If any man have an ear, let him hear. (10) He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. (11) And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. (12) And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. (13) And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, (14) And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by [the means of] those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. (15) And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. (16) And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: (17) And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. (18) Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six.
Sinful man IS the FIRST Beast, rising out of the sea of humanity. When King David sinned, he was as a beast before Elohim:
(Psa 73:22) So foolish [was] I, and ignorant: I was [as] a beast before thee.
Carnal, sinful man is as a beast before Elohim, and the "head" of sinful man is not Elohim, rather it is Satan and those demonic powers that rule over the "beast/sinful man.":
(Jn 8:44) Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
When Yeshua returns, Satan will be bound, and the head of sinful man will receive a mortal wound as he is confined in the bottomless pit until the 1000 years are finished, and then he will in a sense, come back to life to deceive again:
(Rev 20:1-3, 7) (1) And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. (2) And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, (3) And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. (7) And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Do you see? When the thousand years are expired (the Seventh Day/Sabbath/Millennium), Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and that wound (by the Sword/Word of Elohim-v14) will be healed by his release from the abyss after the 1000 years are ended, and the HEAD of sinful man will again be in control of those who desire to worship the carnal flesh/sin.
We are told that the “beast” has an image that everyone worships. This “image” is the created things that sinful mankind worships and lusts after:
(Rom 1:25) Who changed the truth of Elohim into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature (the created things) more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Now, the "mark" of the beast/sinful man IS sin/iniquity:
(Psa 130:3) If thou, Yehovah, shouldest mark iniquities, O Yehovah, who shall stand?
(Job 10:14) If I sin, then thou markest me, and thou wilt not acquit me from mine iniquity.
Sin is what MARKS sinful man as the beast, it identifies who stands before Elohim as a beast.
So, this brings us to the "buying and selling" that requires the "mark of the beast." How could sin/iniquity be used to purchase or sell anything? This answer requires a good understanding of how Elohim's Grace works. Grace is the FREE Gift of Righteousness:
(Gal 2:21) I do not frustrate the grace of Elohim: for if righteousness [come] by the law, then Messiah is dead in vain.
And isn’t righteousness ALL of Elohim's commandments?
(Psa 119:172) My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments [are] righteousness.
Paul teaches that we receive this Grace (the Free Gift of Righteousness) by sinning. Because it was by or through our sin that we did do as the Law required of us to Sacrifice. But this takes faith to believe and receive. So as a free gift, we have been provided the means to whereby we can buy gold/salvation by the Righteousness or Justification found through Yeshua:
(Rev 3:18) I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
This gold/salvation comes at a great cost (the burning/suffering of Messiah Yeshua outside the city gate-Heb 13:11-12), and the end result is the Righteousness we receive by faith. This Righteousness is a DOING of the Law/Torah, not by "works" but according to the Spiritual Fulfillment of the Law/Torah. The Torah required ALL sinners to sacrifice for their sin, and ALL have done this unknowingly, by sacrificing THEIR sin offering (Yeshua) with the help of wicked men (Acts 2:22-23). All sinners did this THROUGH their sin, and without sin (the mark of the beast), they would not be able to receive/purchase the Salvation/Gold that is available from Yeshua:
(Gal 2:17) But if, while we seek to be justified by Messiah, we ourselves also are found sinners (found as having the "mark" of the beast), [is] therefore Messiah the minister of sin? Elohim forbid.
Sin is what crucified Yeshua, and if we continue in sin AFTER receiving THIS Knowledge of the Truth, we SELL the Gold/Salvation that we had received through our faithful confession of killing Yeshua through our sin. So you see, there is no buying or selling IN Yeshua without the "mark of the beast," which is sin. And the "number" of the beast/sinful man, is the number of Elohim's commandments (616), for each and every command of Elohim, NUMBERS us as sinners when we disobey them. The Latin Vulgate has 616 instead of 666, and I would submit that is a more accurate number for the beast, as the number of carnal man’s ways to sin, is the number of commands that have been given.
Here are several excerpts from various articles speaking about the 616 versus 666:
Part 2 next post. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
(Rev 13:1-18) (1) And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy. (2) And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as [the feet] of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority. (3) And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast. (4) And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who [is] like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him? (5) And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty [and] two months. (6) And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against Elohim, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven. (7) And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. (8) And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world. (9) If any man have an ear, let him hear. (10) He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints. (11) And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon. (12) And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed. (13) And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men, (14) And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by [the means of] those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live. (15) And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed. (16) And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads: (17) And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name. (18) Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number [is] Six hundred threescore [and] six.
Sinful man IS the FIRST Beast, rising out of the sea of humanity. When King David sinned, he was as a beast before Elohim:
(Psa 73:22) So foolish [was] I, and ignorant: I was [as] a beast before thee.
Carnal, sinful man is as a beast before Elohim, and the "head" of sinful man is not Elohim, rather it is Satan and those demonic powers that rule over the "beast/sinful man.":
(Jn 8:44) Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
When Yeshua returns, Satan will be bound, and the head of sinful man will receive a mortal wound as he is confined in the bottomless pit until the 1000 years are finished, and then he will in a sense, come back to life to deceive again:
(Rev 20:1-3, 7) (1) And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand. (2) And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, (3) And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season. (7) And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
Do you see? When the thousand years are expired (the Seventh Day/Sabbath/Millennium), Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, and that wound (by the Sword/Word of Elohim-v14) will be healed by his release from the abyss after the 1000 years are ended, and the HEAD of sinful man will again be in control of those who desire to worship the carnal flesh/sin.
We are told that the “beast” has an image that everyone worships. This “image” is the created things that sinful mankind worships and lusts after:
(Rom 1:25) Who changed the truth of Elohim into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature (the created things) more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.
Now, the "mark" of the beast/sinful man IS sin/iniquity:
(Psa 130:3) If thou, Yehovah, shouldest mark iniquities, O Yehovah, who shall stand?
(Job 10:14) If I sin, then thou markest me, and thou wilt not acquit me from mine iniquity.
Sin is what MARKS sinful man as the beast, it identifies who stands before Elohim as a beast.
So, this brings us to the "buying and selling" that requires the "mark of the beast." How could sin/iniquity be used to purchase or sell anything? This answer requires a good understanding of how Elohim's Grace works. Grace is the FREE Gift of Righteousness:
(Gal 2:21) I do not frustrate the grace of Elohim: for if righteousness [come] by the law, then Messiah is dead in vain.
And isn’t righteousness ALL of Elohim's commandments?
(Psa 119:172) My tongue shall speak of thy word: for all thy commandments [are] righteousness.
Paul teaches that we receive this Grace (the Free Gift of Righteousness) by sinning. Because it was by or through our sin that we did do as the Law required of us to Sacrifice. But this takes faith to believe and receive. So as a free gift, we have been provided the means to whereby we can buy gold/salvation by the Righteousness or Justification found through Yeshua:
(Rev 3:18) I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and [that] the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.
This gold/salvation comes at a great cost (the burning/suffering of Messiah Yeshua outside the city gate-Heb 13:11-12), and the end result is the Righteousness we receive by faith. This Righteousness is a DOING of the Law/Torah, not by "works" but according to the Spiritual Fulfillment of the Law/Torah. The Torah required ALL sinners to sacrifice for their sin, and ALL have done this unknowingly, by sacrificing THEIR sin offering (Yeshua) with the help of wicked men (Acts 2:22-23). All sinners did this THROUGH their sin, and without sin (the mark of the beast), they would not be able to receive/purchase the Salvation/Gold that is available from Yeshua:
(Gal 2:17) But if, while we seek to be justified by Messiah, we ourselves also are found sinners (found as having the "mark" of the beast), [is] therefore Messiah the minister of sin? Elohim forbid.
Sin is what crucified Yeshua, and if we continue in sin AFTER receiving THIS Knowledge of the Truth, we SELL the Gold/Salvation that we had received through our faithful confession of killing Yeshua through our sin. So you see, there is no buying or selling IN Yeshua without the "mark of the beast," which is sin. And the "number" of the beast/sinful man, is the number of Elohim's commandments (616), for each and every command of Elohim, NUMBERS us as sinners when we disobey them. The Latin Vulgate has 616 instead of 666, and I would submit that is a more accurate number for the beast, as the number of carnal man’s ways to sin, is the number of commands that have been given.
Here are several excerpts from various articles speaking about the 616 versus 666:
Part 2 next post. Blessings in The Name, ImAHebrew.
Sinful man IS the FIRST Beast, rising out of the sea of humanity.
And Ken, isn't man already sinful without having to rise up at all?
Revelation 13:1 by John: And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
Daniel 7And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another....
After this I saw in the night visions, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and strong exceedingly; and it had great iron teeth: it devoured and brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with the feet of it: and it was diverse from all the beasts that were before it; and it had ten horns.....
I came near unto one of them that stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me, and made me know the interpretation of the things. These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth....
Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces..
So John's FIRST beast king and kingdom is Daniel's FOURTH beast king and kingdom that rises up out of the sea, and your problem Ken, is that you use the wrong set of scriptures to properly interpret itself on the matter.
And I guess there is no one able to post on LO-AMMI to even tell you of your mistake.